Christianity and Impact of westernization on Indian culture

[devil]

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musharraf is your puppet why you asking us how is it working

[sunny_10]

You are so right. Mush is an US poodle. He can't get back home because he fears to be lynched even before the cops can arrest him for pending criminal cases.

he is one of the jailed American voters, so is defended by their laws

I just posted a news as below, in response to AA with asking, how raping a girl like this is wrong in either way????????

http://www.indiandefence.com/forums/...tml#post234869

in western countries, they laugh on the 'culture background' we have but they have more to shame on themselves than laughing on others. like that news, i dont think that raping that girl was wrong in either sense . she already had sex with Doctor Sharma many times, she did drink and came to his home that night from pub which simply means that she was ready to get fcuked, as usual in australia. as, once you pick a girl from pub, it simply means that you are going to fcuk her....... also, we have an Indian view, that is, we do know that these girl are very much like prostitutes, fcuking here and there and it just depends whom they want to fcuk and whom they dont want, any particular night

our culture background gives us a sense of responsibility. a responsibility with our own career for what we studied hard and spent heavy money, and also with the reputation of our family. we do know that we just can't start fcuking here and there as we have our career and we just dont want any type of trouble in it. and also we have our responsible approach with our family back home. we are certainly not like those Aussie who have over 15 mothers-fathers, and over 80% of them are under high school passed, work for few days and spend all on the weekends on these girls. they have much to hate us and at the same time we don't even have enough time to think about their current status. this Indian doctor just got caught, as, may be that girl might have demanded money on morning..... otherwise you just can't think about these girls for more than one night . australian laws might be punishing the people who 'rape' these 'social' girls while i dont find these girls deserve the status of 'rape victim' in either sense .

[MiG-23MLD]

hmmm they are either non-believer or they want only Christians. just see how easy it is for the people of Philippines to get migrated to a Western country while it is so hard for Muslims? there is always a religious war being funded by Western politicians, and their people, whether they are Christians or non-believers

Im not against Casual Sex, but Im discussing the outcome of it, how Western countries have reached this level. their society of Single Mothers and their kids who only have competition of having new girl friends since schooling, without much concerned for studies, just no 'competition' for studies in their schools

I am christian and i can tell you that christinity first is not homogeneous, second western countries are not theocracies, but are ruled by secular governments.

In Mexico, we are Western in culture and geography, we are secular and mostly christian.


In Mexico gay marriage for example is allowed and legal.
Now this a secular view since christianity does not accept gay marriage.

Secular goverments in the west do not allow muslims for one simple reason, as christians are not welcome in muslim countries too.

Muslims usually do not grant the rights they enjoy in the west, for example in the west the have large communities however muslims persecute christians and do not allow evangelization of muslims.

So in my opinion why we have to be so kind with them if they in the first place do not grant the same rights we give them in the west when we are in their countries as christians?


Now chistianity as a religion is excellent, but the west is not christian but secular, in Mexico for example you have athiests who have enough power to allow gay marriage or secular education.

Pornography, single mothers and divorce are not promoted by christianity but by secular people who mostly are athiests.

[sunny_10]

I am christian and i can tell you that christinity first is not homogeneous, second western countries are not theocracies, but are ruled by secular governments.

In Mexico, we are Western in culture and geography, we are secular and mostly christian.


In Mexico gay marriage for example is allowed and legal.
Now this a secular view since christianity does not accept gay marriage.

Secular goverments in the west do not allow muslims for one simple reason, as christians are not welcome in muslim countries too.

Muslims usually do not grant the rights they enjoy in the west, for example in the west the have large communities however muslims persecute christians and do not allow evangelization of muslims.

So in my opinion why we have to be so kind with them if they in the first place do not grant the same rights we give them in the west when we are in their countries as christians?


Now chistianity as a religion is excellent, but the west is not christian but secular, in Mexico for example you have athiests who have enough power to allow gay marriage or secular education.

Pornography, single mothers and divorce are not promoted by christianity but by secular people who mostly are athiests.

sir, I would like to explain few things in a bit clear way. as until we can't discuss the 'problem', we can't find its solution. first I would tell you about the 3 simple stages of discriminations in Australia, I have seen from very close:

1st, I had my one senior in my company WMA Ltd, Faisel, who used to send his kids to Muslim Schools in Perth. and I know the reason, that is, it is an 'official' policy of the government of Australia to break down 'belief' of different 'non-christian' religious people by fcuking their daughters and sons even since schooling through their generation of Single Mothers, who themselves are from more than 15-20 mothers-fathers and they hate to think that someone is having 'one' father-mother. they 'hate' the people who may prove these generations of 'Single Mother', below standard as they are not even sure about their correct father. in australia, you have to give name of your mother in schools, not father. and then, as per policy of Australian government, they allow 'heavy' advertisement of Christianity among these 'non-believers'on the streets of Sydney, which can be seen commonly there......

2nd, and only after proving that you are either a Christian or 'non-believer', by fcuking here and there, you then qualify for the 2nd stage of discrimination in Australia, which then includes South Americans and these 'non-believer' Asians, like the case of this Indian Doctor and many other similar cases. this discrimination then involve discrimination based on 'race', which badly hurt South Americans as they have mixed race. this discrimination always put you down to your western partner, whether she or he.
(and here we find Indians little better place as they are generally on the higher paid jobs, and ready to compromise in tough circumstances. i mean, if you work for 4 days and fcuk rest of the 3 days then you are only living your life and have not much in pocket to spend. but for example of this Indian doctor, she went to his 'house', he might have paid for full drinks in pubs also. my most of the friends in australia have flat/house while we do find many Aussies find it hard to have even a single room, and they can hardly offer $12 per 5 litre wine to serve a woman )

3rd: discriminations based on nationality, and here again South Americans and Asians are put very down.

I tell you something in short, "there is always a 'war' organized by the western nations on the name of religion/race/nationality. they always have someone on their target and others in their waiting list. and their different wars will never end until they will have 'enslaved' rest of world. and you only have to defend yourself."

i have seen from very close that they either want those Indians who abuse India in western nations or those Indians who are basically wrong/criminals to prove this is how the Indians are. and by abusing India, the nation and its culture, you may at least prove yourself 'good', due to your 'english education' background, being loyal to British this way. there is not the third option that you may say 'good' for India/its culture and avoid discriminations with yourself. and as I do have a good political mind, here I may give a clear information that, "those who can't even listen 'good' for a developing country like India, they will never be good for that certain country. and if at any stage of time they may prove India the nation/indian culture wrong, then it will only mean that they will then get a license to attack on India by political, economic or finally by military means." or, one of the best way is to maintain support for the countries like China, Iran etc to keep a resistance to this Western Aggression. and we are 'helpless' on our geo-political stand

[MiG-23MLD]

sir, I would like to explain few things in a bit clear way. as until we can't discuss the 'problem', we can't find its solution. first I would tell you about the 3 simple stages of discriminations in Australia, I have seen from very close:


3rd: discriminations based on nationality, and here again South Americans and Asians are put very down.

I tell you something in short, "there is always a 'war' organized by the western nations on the name of religion/race/nationality. they always have someone on their target and others in their waiting list. and their different wars will never end until they will have 'enslaved' rest of world. and you only have to defend yourself."

i

Sunny


Australia is not the only western country, second you are wrong, South america has a very large percentage of European ethic root, in fact 45% of Latin America is of European descent and only 45% is of mix blood and the rest is native american or african origin.

Nations like Argentina or Uruguay are basicly european nations, Brazil is 45% european.

So we are basicly Western, because we are descendants of Rome via Spain and Portugal.

We share the greek culture with Europe and the US.

Are we pure European? no of course not, but our culture is based upon western values.

Mexicans we are less European, but we have an ethnic composition of 70%-65 mixed blood spanish-native american and some degree of moorish-arabic blood; 10-15% European descendants and 20% native americans.

this is how we mexicans look

Western countries are defined by being christian and have important cultural relations with Europe,

Australia is not even more Western than Argentina in fact Argentina has more than 40 million people of which at least 35 million are descentants of Europeans.

Brazil has 200 million people with at least 95 milion are descentands of Europeans and the largest catholic populations.
Barak Obama is Mulato but still is western

Your experience is understandable, but do not think Australia is a typical western country, the West is devided in north Saxon and south Latin.

EU is European mostly secular with diminishing christians populations, the US saxon like Australia are saxon and protestant, but Argentina or Brazil are latin and catholic.

We are western but we are not the developed or imperialist west

[sunny_10]

Sunny


Australia is not the only western country, second you are wrong, South america has a very large percentage of European ethic root, in fact 45% of Latin America is of European descent and only 45% is of mix blood and the rest is native american or african origin.

Nations like Argentina or Uruguay are basicly european nations, Brazil is 45% european.

So we are basicly Western, because we are descendants of Rome via Spain and Portugal.

We share the greek culture with Europe and the US.

Are we pure European? no of course not, but our culture is based upon western values.

Mexicans we are less European, but we have an ethnic composition of 70%-65 mixed blood spanish-native american and some degree of moorish-arabic blood; 10-15% European descendants and 20% native americans.

this is how we mexicans look

Western countries are defined by being christian and have important cultural relations with Europe,

Australia is not even more Western than Argentina in fact Argentina has more than 40 million people of which at least 35 million are descentants of Europeans.

Brazil has 200 million people with at least 95 milion are descentands of Europeans and the largest catholic populations.
Barak Obama is Mulato but still is western

Your experience is understandable, but do not think Australia is a typical western country, the West is devided in north Saxon and south Latin.

EU is European mostly secular with diminishing christians populations, the US saxon like Australia are saxon and protestant, but Argentina or Brazil are latin and catholic.

We are western but we are not the developed or imperialist west

sir, I do know the races of South America. I met many whites who 'proud' to be white while many and many looks like Chinese also, yes its true and quite common as what they told me. i hope you would be agree......

and if you are a white then you fall in the 3rd category of discrimination, based on nationalities. like how Americans used to proud to be americans till 90s while the same South Americans used shy to say about their nationalities till last decade. the 3rd point as per my last post....

[sunny_10]

'
India needs to learn from Chinese model‏

the problem with immature Indians here, if they want to go against fanatic Islam then they find themselves with Western group. and if they want to resist western dominance, then they find themselves moving towards the Islamic Jihadi groups who fight with christian religious Western dominance. while your main ground would be to resist both of that side and put your stand clearly. and on my side, I always keep space for any credible change in society etc also, which may benefit the society as a whole, but first it would prove itself worth/good for the common people, the society......

yesterday i was talking that Indian rulers/diplomats gotto learn from Chinese model. you always have to understand that US/West always trying to give you disadvantage on the different businesses, hiding the facts/truth, and trying to cheat the nation, India. even if IT companies have export orders from west, they pay very high tax and deliver the best projects at a very less cost? India, in fact, suffer Trade Deficit with US+EU. you gotto think to the level that, "no business was ever done to benefit other side and if you down yourself on any issue then it simply means that you want to benefit other side." India just need to stick with the norms of WTO and keep kicking US/West, who want to first give losses to India on different businesses and at the same time they want to involve india in their different wars, which they have mainly organized to solve their 1000s Christian religious issues with Islam. first India won't become an arm of Christianity against Islam and at the same time Indian diplomacy gotto be well prepared to handle those western champions, mainly British and British origins of US/Australia/Canada, who always want some space to give losses to India, on the business side, political side and also doing wrong publicity about India, about indian society as whole.......

if india sell products to US then India buy from them also and in fact India suffer trade deficit from US+EU? and no business was done to benefit other side and if western firms recruit high qualified professionals then they do this after a long process of selection and then they pick only their people of interest, who may develop new techs for them, and inprove the existing technologies also. as, why would they bring people from overseas while their own unemployment rate is very high? and in fact, whenever US's president and UK's PM visit India, they mainly beg for jobs in India? and if they want high skilled migration then its in very limited number and to select the best people they may find from India or an indian origin from a foreign institute? India needs to stick with norms of WTO/UN and keep kicking those enemies who just want to destroy your country...........

Indians gotto learn to handle to different sides in different ways. if you talk to a pakistani national then present every aspect in front of him and if you then get to face a US's national then you then have to talk in a different way, considering that side of politics. with always taking care that a western citizen will only serve his nation, whether he/she is an Indian origin or not. an Indian American will only defend his nation and you have to defend your own country you are based in, the India. as, every good and bad of India is concerned with Indian nationals only, regardless what an American Indian say here to defend US/UK/Australia/Canada...............

in short, India needs to learn from Chinese model and get very high growth like China, like how China achieved the highest growth during last 30 years on its geo-political stand, much higher growth than India.....

David Cameron delivers address at Infosys Bangalore: Full Text
July 28, 2010

The Tata Group is now the largest manufacturing employer in Britain. And more than 180 Indian companies have invested in our IT sector.

Indian companies employ 90,000 people in the UK. Many more jobs in Britain exist thanks to the activities of British companies in India. Now I want to see thousands more jobs created in Britain, and of course in India through trade in the months and years ahead. That is the core purpose of my visit

David Cameron delivers address at Infosys Bangalore: Full Text | NDTV.com

India's exports to European countries increased by about 16 per cent to USD 57.7 billion in 2011-12, while imports rose by about 29 per cent year-on-year to USD 91.5 billion.

http://www.financialexpress.com/news...ts-29-/985545/

[MiG-23MLD]

sir, I do know the races of South America. I met many whites who 'proud' to be white while many and many looks like Chinese also, yes its true and quite common as what they told me. i hope you would be agree......

and if you are a white then you fall in the 3rd category of discrimination, based on nationalities. like how Americans used to proud to be americans till 90s while the same South Americans used shy to say about their nationalities till last decade. the 3rd point as per my last post....

Sunny


You are just generalizing.

I have lived in New Zealand, Canada and the US, so i know the type of discrimination you are talking about.


I know first hand, how native american, african looking or mix blood are looked there.

I know racism, in latin america there is racism too, but racism is not purely western, in China, Japan or India there is racism too








However your point of view does not understand the reaction of western Christians with regards Muslims, in muslim countries christians while tolerated are also discriminated.

Now about Australia, Australia first is not a race, like Mexico, is a multi-racial multi-cultural country, so you are just complaigning about the white racism in Australia of a minority.

Christianity is not racist, in christianity all races are seen equal, read the book of Romans of the bible, Your saying white racist australians are christians, it is not true, true christians are not racist.


However understand is logic Christian countries do not want Muslims, or other religions to multiply, so there is always a rejection of some non christian values.


In latine america we have more mixed blood simply because we have a longer multicultural experience, australia is also going that way, but they are trying to fight the fact that they are located in asia, not Europe or the americas so they do not want to change the cultural face of australia

[sunny_10]

I mainly have experience of australia, have australian citizenship too. and here, could you please tell us why the British prisoners/criminals fcuked the women of indigenous people there in 19th and 20th centuries to spread christianity among them? as per the link of post #118 of this thread as below????????

http://www.indiandefence.com/forums/...culture-8.html

[sunny_10]

thats what British did in Australia during 19th and 20th centuries, as below:

The effect of British colonisation on Aboriginal people

Between 1788 and 1900, the Aboriginal population was reduced by 90%. Three main reasons for this were the introduction of new diseases, loss of land and loss of people through direct fighting with the colonisers.


Introduced diseases

The most immediate consequence of British settlement was the appearance of European diseases. Most were epidemic diseases such as chickenpox, smallpox, influenza and measles. As these diseases were infectious, they spread very quickly and killed many people. In large Aboriginal communities, the diseases spread even more quickly.


Loss of land

Another consequence of British settlement was the reduction of access to land and water resources. The settlers took the view that Aboriginal people, with a nomadic lifestyle, could easily be driven away from their lands. By the 1870s all the fertile areas of Australia had been taken from Aboriginal people and given to the white settlers. The loss of land and other essential resources such as food and water posed great danger to Aboriginal people who were left with no place to live and nowhere to hunt food. Already weakened by the new diseases spread by the new settlers, Aboriginal people had dramatically reduced chances for survival.

See image 3

The British settlers also introduced alcohol to Aboriginal people which affected them very badly.

When the Europeans started raising stock in ranches, several changes took place. Many Aboriginal people lost their land. The spread of European livestock over vast areas also restricted the nomadic lifestyle of Aboriginal people.

From these ranches, Aboriginal people had a new supply of fresh meat, which changed their nutrition, their eating habits and ways of finding food. As a consequence, Aboriginal people started to depend on European settlers for their food and livelihood.

In the later 19th century, new settlers took vital parts of the land in the north, such as waterholes or soaks, for their own use. They also introduced sheep, rabbits and cattle. These animals took over fertile areas and fouled the land. Consequently, the native animals that Aboriginal people depended on to hunt began to disappear. Aboriginal people started to hunt sheep and cattle as they could no longer rely on hunting native animals.

During the 1850s, gold was found in south-eastern Australia. Many white pastoral workers left their stock farms or ranches to search for gold. Many Aboriginal men, women and children were hired to work in cattle stations and in other less popular industries, such as diving for pearls. Instead of being paid, Aboriginal people received food, clothing and other basic necessities.

Christian missions often provided food and clothing for Aboriginal communities and opened schools and orphanages for Aboriginal children. In some places, colonial governments also provided some resources.

In remote areas, some Aboriginal communities managed to retain their traditional lifestyles as late as the 1930s.

In general, at the beginning, the British colonisers were welcomed, or at least not opposed by Aboriginal people. With time, however, when the impact of the British settlement increased, there were more and more conflicts between the white settlers and Aboriginal people, which often resulted in massacre.

In the Northern Territory until as late as the 1930s, Europeans travellers were sometimes speared to death.In retaliation, some European settlers shot Aboriginal people. The most severe series of killings in the Northern Territory occurred at Caledon Bay, which became a turning point in the relationship between Aboriginal people and the white settlers.

Consequences of British colonisation for Aboriginal People, British colonisation of Australia, Colonisation: resources, power and exploration, SOSE Year 6, QLD | Online Education Home Schooling Skwirk Australia

and this is what the Indigenous people want to do in Australia right now, as, they simply dont want to follow laws of Australia, which still have British Queen as Head of State there

In 2008 Aboriginal people represent only 2.3% of the total population, yet over 14% of Australia's prison population are Aboriginal people.

31.9% Percentage by which Aboriginal imprisonment rates increased between 2000 and 2006 . 12.9 Factor by which Aboriginal people are more likely to be imprisoned than non-Aboriginal people.

60% Percentage by which the imprisonment rate for Aboriginal women increased between 2000 and 2010. Same figure for Aboriginal men: 35%.

Aboriginal prison rates

[vstol jockey]

thats what British did in Australia during 19th and 20th centuries, as below:



and this is what the Indigenous people want to do in Australia right now, as, they simply dont want to follow laws of Australia, which still have British Queen as Head of State there

This is what happens when a land is colonised by those who were outlawed even in their own country.

[Averageamerican]

Social Darwinism, its in evitable, change or die. The diseases would have eventually reached the Aboriginal population sooner or later. Hunting gathering populations are allways replaced by farm/industrial population. The more efficent are going to always replace the less efficent. Same thing is happening to Islamic countries today. Compete or die. Survival of the fittest, its the rule of nature and its the rule of mankind, there are no romantic sentimental exceptions.

Organic Society



The very first form and foundation of social evolution was the philosophy of organic society. Organic society is the prospective that societies are really living organisms that undergo many of the same stages and developments that animals and humans go through. The very first of these philosophies can be traced back to the 14th century in the writings of Ibn Khaldun, and Islamic scholar. Social evolution truly culminated after the work of Charles Darwin with his book, The Origin of Species. In 1859, Charles Darwin established the theory of natural selection. Natural selection holds that particular traits are useful to an individual's survival and reproduction and that over time, the traits that are useful become more frequent than traits that are less useful. Sociologists applied this theory of natural selection to a social setting. Essentially, there are particular behavioral and social traits that allow individuals to survive and reproduce better than others. Behavioral and social traits that are not useful eventually become infrequent and can potentially die out; behavioral and social traits that are useful become more frequent.



Read more: Theory of Social Evolution | eHow.com Theory of Social Evolution | eHow.com

[MiG-23MLD]

I mainly have experience of australia, have australian citizenship too. and here, could you please tell us why the British prisoners/criminals fcuked the women of indigenous people there in 19th and 20th centuries to spread christianity among them? as per the link of post #118 of this thread as below????????

http://www.indiandefence.com/forums/...culture-8.html

I understand your point but you are still without really understanding Christianity.


I am Mexican, our history is the reflex of Spanish warriors looking for gold with a cross and some Spanish missionaries will real care for the native americans


To start, Christianity is based upon the non-violent social disobedience.


Ghandi never preached violence, however some of his followers might have been violent.
Christ was the same, however false christians practice violence.


Through out History you will find Christians who never practice violence, who were peaceful and even martirized, while you also will find false christians practicing violence.


Mexico was the same, Hernan Cortez represented, the organized power thirsty Spanish crown who promoted conquest and bible and slavery in exchange of gold.

However some christian missionaries did really care for the native americans and practice true christianity.


Your whole idead that Australians are "evil christians" is a pure cliche, a misunderstanding of christianity, plus a generalization of a people, i have met very good christian australians as evil false christian australians my self

But it does not mean Christianity is a violent religion or a racist religion that promotes violence, sexual promiscuity or decadent values, core chrsitianity is peaceful and a very moral religion.

First read the Bible with an open eye with true christian australians and your predujices about christianity will fade away

[MiG-23MLD]

Social Darwinism, its in evitable, change or die. The diseases would have eventually reached the Aboriginal population sooner or later. Hunting gathering populations are allways replaced by farm/industrial population. The more efficent are going to always replace the less efficent. Same thing is happening to Islamic countries today. Compete or die. Survival of the fittest, its the rule of nature and its the rule of mankind, there are no romantic sentimental exceptions.

Organic Society



The very first form and foundation of social evolution was the philosophy of organic society. Organic society is the prospective that societies are really living organisms that undergo many of the same stages and developments that animals and humans go through. The very first of these philosophies can be traced back to the 14th century in the writings of Ibn Khaldun, and Islamic scholar. Social evolution truly culminated after the work of Charles Darwin with his book, The Origin of Species. In 1859, Charles Darwin established the theory of natural selection. Natural selection holds that particular traits are useful to an individual's survival and reproduction and that over time, the traits that are useful become more frequent than traits that are less useful. Sociologists applied this theory of natural selection to a social setting. Essentially, there are particular behavioral and social traits that allow individuals to survive and reproduce better than others. Behavioral and social traits that are not useful eventually become infrequent and can potentially die out; behavioral and social traits that are useful become more frequent.



Read more: Theory of Social Evolution | eHow.com Theory of Social Evolution | eHow.com

here Sunny you find a very good example, average american is not promoting christianity, but athiest values of the american society, his opinions are basicly promoting what hitler promoted, but he might come from a nation with a majority of christians, he himself promotes athiest values.

He does not represent christianity niether averarage americans

[Averageamerican]

If the English and Spanish had not settled USA or Australia, it would have just been someone else the Russans, Chinese, Japnese. and just a matter of time. The more advanced civilizations are allways going to dominate the less progressive areas of the world sooner or later. Religion only comes into play if it promotes change or hinder changes which is one of the main differance between Islam and Christianity, Christianity is a religon while Islam is more then a religon....Islam is a threefold system—a religious-political-cultural ideology and because its inflexibility holds back the development of Islamic Countries, the results as President Musharraf put it. "Today we are the poorest, the most illiterate, the most backward, the most unhealthy, the most un-enlightened, the most deprived, and the weakest of all the human race.